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Is anyone studying Lord of the Flies book, or is that in English Language?
Piggy gets merked when dem honkeys chuck dem rock at em E8
I have never studied Lord of the Flies, but i am quite knowledgeable in it anyways
i could give anyone any help if they want :)
ps Patmore will own yr estate anyday of the week
Oh, I'm studying 'Lord Of The Flies' for English Literature.What a book(!)
yes im studying lord of the flies.
Yep, Lord of the Flies. It's English Lit. What do guys think of it?
My opinion only, but the book is not fascinating AT ALL!
Yes, wonderful pyschological side to it all, and it makes you think and all, but I'd prefer a book that was more... deep?
What about you? What do you think?
I agree. I don't like the constant description of the island; I understand that it sometimes reflects the characters emotions and shows how man is destructive...but I think that the constant description isn't always needed. However, they are pre-pubescent boys, and so Golding can only explore their violent nature in a certain respect, and not explore other areas of humanity that would be apparent if, for example, the island was a group of adults of mixed gender.
Who is your favourite character? ;)
Actually, yes, that is a good point. Mixed gender and adults would have been better.
Errm, I would say Simon, he's very pure and fair, in my opinion.
Jack and Ralph are just terribly annoying.
What about you? Who's your favourite?
I agree with both of you, about the description and how it may have been more interesting with other people but I guess thats because Golding taught in a boys school for a while. And Simon is most definitely my favourite character too I think he is extremely insightful but because he is so shy he can't express himself i.e "Simon became inarticuate in his effort to express mankinds essential illness" etc. If I was in the novel I would have killed Jack ages ago like in the beginning but I quite like Ralph and how he also becomes a little philosopher. :D
Also do you have any ideas on the main themes of the novel e.g Good and Evil, Law and Order against Crowd Mentality, What the Conch Symbolizes etc and on the other characters like Roger and Piggy.
Well, I think the conch symbolises civilisation. When the conch is brought out, it brings out law and order. But, when it is destroyed, civilisation is destroyed. There is absolutely no law or order. The little democracy they had, is now destroyed.
You'd think Jack's dictatorship would be worse than Ralph's democracy-however, at the end, they have barbarians and savagelike boys. So, what they have is worse than a dictatorship.
So, I guess, Golding is showing a political side , as well as pyschological and religious.In my opinion, Simon brings the religion out well (-as Golding was a strong Catholic).
Also, I don't know whether this point is quite adequate. But, as you (Zoe) have mentioned the characters; Ralph, Jack, Simon and Piggy are the main ones.
Hence, they may all be symoblising the 4 elements.
Earth--> Piggy (Logic)
Water --> Ralph (How water and fire are rivals/ Water can get rid of fire.)
Fire -->Jack (His ginger hair, and angry manner.)
Air --> Simon (What we all need.)
Not exactly sure, but that's what I think.What do you guys think? :)
Modified once, last modified by Rhanid on Fri 15th April, 2011 @ 17:34
Yep, the conch definitely symbolises democracy. There are great parallels between the conch and Piggy. Piggy is the one who finds the conch, and he is the one who recognises that it could be more than just a 'plaything', and who uses it to signal the others. When democracy is failing, he clings to it desperately - he still naively believes that you need the conch to speak. When all the boys go crazy at the thought of a fire, 'the conch lay forgotten', and in a way, so does Piggy. When democracy is falling apart we can see this visually in both Piggy and the Conch; Piggy's glasses are broken and the Conch loses its original pink glow and becomes grey/white, having been discoloured by the Sun. Piggy and the Conch both meet their end at the same time, as when Roger pushes the boulder onto Piggy, both the conch and Piggy's skull breaks.
Don't forget Roger in the book. Although his role isn't a prominent one, it is crucial; he is the only true sadist of the group, and it is him that pushes the boulder onto Piggy. He represents not tyranny himself, but how tyranny can grow if it is supported. In the macrocosm, he isn't a leader, but an assistant that helps leaders grow stronger.
Hope this helps :) Anymore ideas?
I like the ideas of the boys each representing an element, that's a really clever idea. XD
Modified twice, last modified by Rebecca on Sat 16th April, 2011 @ 15:59
Damn, I wish I remember these points in the exam! ;D
Lord of the flies and identity: Religion, loss of identity
One way to view the Simon/Lord of the Flies scene is to say that the talking pig’s head isn’t a mere hallucination – it’s the actual Lord of the Flies, the Devil, evil incarnate, talking to Simon via a severed head. Simon might be considered to be a lot like Jesus. To start with, his name is Simon, which happens to be the name of one of the twelve apostles. Simon started out as Simon until Jesus decided really his name should be “Peter” instead. And then there’s Simon’s affinity for meditation, his kindred spirit with animals, his “suffer the little children unto me” attitude (think about the fruit-picking), and his ability to prophesize (like when he tells Ralph that Ralph will get home, and sort of suggests that he himself won’t). Simon is one big religious guy. Having established that, we can go back to our pig’s-head-on-a stick scene and compare it to Jesus’s visit to the the night before he was crucified. Now, when we say visit, what we really mean is long and solitary mental suffering, much like Simon undergoes the night before he meets his own untimely death. Simon is “thirsty,” and later “very thirsty,” and although the text doesn’t say it, we can only assume that at one point later he is very, very thirsty. He’s also sweating, having a seizure, and bleeding profusely from his nose.
As the boys in Lord of the Flies grow more violent, they begin painting their faces with clay, supposedly so the pigs won’t see them, but in reality to make themselves feel better about their atrocious acts. As the boys grow more savage and less like their normal selves, we see this change manifest itself physically in their appearances. Unsurprisingly, the looks match the insides: the boys are becoming more primitive, so they shed their clothes and decorate themselves with war paint. It’s also important that the paint makes them look very similar to one another; they no longer have names or individual identities of their own. This allows them to shed their civilized selves and become nameless creatures that kill and murder.
Random notes from my A-levels, that i found out i cannot use because it is GCSE text. Wonderful, hopes it helps
All these ideas are really good!!!!!!! Wow. :) I didn't think about the boys being the four elements or Piggy similar to the conch or how the boys loose their identities to such depth. Thanks sooooooo much you've all really helped. I just hope I remember at least some of these points for the exam and that I can find some way of relating it to the question. :) THANK YOU!!!!!!!!!!!
Here are few practise questions my teacher gave us:
Write about the relationship between Jack and Ralph and how it relates to the themes of the novel.
Write about the significance of the beast in the novel.
Write about the presentation of the character Simon.
Write about the presentation of the character Piggy.
Write about the presentation of the character Roger.
Hope they are any good? :)
Modified once, last modified by Zoeeee on Sun 17th April, 2011 @ 20:32
Yay, thanks for the questions! :D
Can someone just sum up Roger's character if possible?
I haven't actually read the book in GREAT depth yet, and I hope I won't have to, but will someone do that, please? :)
http://www.bbc.co.uk/schools/gcsebitesize/english_literature/proselordflies/2prose_lord_flies_charrev3.shtml hope that helps x
Aw, great-thanks for this. :)
you're welcome hope it helps x
Thanks that really helps, I forgot all about bitesize. :)
you're welcome **
does anyone know the questions that came up last year? (:
How is violence portrayed in lord of the fliess
or what is the importance of simon